Last fall, Elissa had the opportunity to interview some Karen youth in St. Paul, MN. They met at a Karen grocery store, shared a meal together, and talked about various aspects of the Karen culture. We have divided this interview into a four part series: Culture, Immigration, Family and Faith, and Food and Holidays. For authenticity, we have transcribed the interview material as accurate as possible.
The Karen People
We encourage our readers to visit the Karen Organization of Minnesota website in order to learn more about the history and culture of the Karen people.
Part 2: Immigration
Elissa: What is the best thing about living in the USA?
Re: Getting a good education, like even seeking to go forward for college or postsecondary there are people willing to help and help us to try to achieve our dreams. Back in Thailand, I felt like a lot of us or most of us didn't have a lot of dreams. So even after you have been graduating from a school, [for] everyone as long as they have a stable job, that is good enough for them. They don't really have a house or really professional job.
Kyeh: I feel like living in the USA the younger kids are being heard, because when we were [in Thailand] it was mostly focused on the elders and it didn't seem like our voices were heard. We were told in the refugee camp that kids aren't as important as the adults and older people. So I think that it is best [here] because our voice is heard.
Hsar: The food, the vegetables, and egg or meat, or anything that you might want to eat. There is so much food that I never tried before. Back then I was so skinny, and now I'm not. I really like to try the different types of things.
Htoo: The best thing is resting. Back in Thailand we were sometimes at school, but we were also out in the field.
Kyeh: It is better, because in Thailand some kids didn't have enough food and didn't always get to eat meals. So I think that this is better, and we can get an education here.
Re: I would also say the freedom. We have more freedom here, because when we lived in Thailand we had limited freedom because it was a refugee camp. We were not allowed to leave the camp. We were not allowed to do anything.
Elissa: How old were all of you when you came?
Re: I was 9.
Kyeh: I was 11.
Hsar: I was 10.
Htoo: I was 12.
Elissa: So, you guys can all clearly remember what life was like there and what it is like here?
Elissa: What is the worst thing about living in the USA?
Kyeh: Well, I have seen a lot of problems here, like different racial situations. In Thailand we are all the same, and we are together. We lived in small communities, like we shared the littlest thing that we had. Coming here, at times, we are so isolated, you know, and I don’t think that is a good thing. We’re all in different places; we’re not as close as like other.
Re: People say like in America you have a lot of freedom, but basically you have to pay for hospital bill, car bill, water bill, electricity bill, and if you are on medications you have to pay for that. You know, you just have to pay for a lot of stuff.
Kyeh: You know, we think of it as the best, but there are still other problems that we need to solve.
Htoo: I would say waking up early. Young kids, you know, they have to wake up early. I don’t know if I think that is healthy for them.
Elissa: You mean for school?
Htoo: Yeah. Nowadays they have technology, and kids stay up too late, and they don’t get enough sleep. They want things a lot, and they want it quickly. They also are disrespectful at times when they do things like talk back to their mom. They respond with that they have freedom and can do whatever they want. Back in Thailand it was different, you know. You got to listen to your parents, because if you don’t, you go and be a soldier and fight for your country.
Elissa: So, discipline is different now being here in the United States.
Kyeh: Kids are kind of using their freedom to do everything. They want to go against their parents and say things like, “It’s America, so there is freedom.” At times they use that as an excuse to get away with things.
Htoo: It’s hard, because in America you can’t really depend on someone else to take care of you. You have to have work and get a job you got to have those things in order to be able to afford rent. Back in Thailand if you have no one or no money you could just go live with someone, and they would do the things that needed to be done to support.
Elissa: Have you ever felt excluded because of your culture?
Re: When we first came I felt excluded, because I was Karen. At my school that I went to there wasn’t many Asian students. It was mostly white and black, and they didn’t know much about me. A few kids tried to come up and talk to me, but mostly they would just ask my name. We couldn't really communicate either, because I didn't really know how to speak English.
Htoo: You know, when I come to America there was not a lot of Karen kids, and the less you are home the less you would communicate. If you need to go somewhere, they will go with you. If you have to travel, you just ask them and they will help you out. It's like being one together. Like when the teacher would sit with you, you would feel kind of bad, but if there is another person who needs help you don’t feel so bad and you can do it together, you know. So, with a ton of Karen people helping each other, it is good.
Elissa: What was the hardest part about transitioning from living in Thailand to living in the US?
Re: Adapting to everything, like my surroundings, the people, and the food. Everything was new and had changed completely. I was really confused when I got here. I didn't understand what was happening around me. I had to make myself learn more about other stuff and challenge myself to be more adapted to it.
Kyeh: The hardest thing for me was socializing, because I didn't know how to speak English, but I learned to try to speak with others. I would want to ask questions, but it was hard to do, because I don't know English. I would wonder if I should ask it myself or just let it go. Kids talking to teachers were like so close to each other. They don't separate themselves from the teachers. When teachers say something that they don’t like, they would talk back. So, I didn't know what I was supposed to act like.
Htoo: I’m ok with everything as it is, because when I was a kid I was very curious. I would wonder why do you need friends to be happy or why do you need other people. I would just always be on my own, just finding my own way. I had just come to America, and it opened my eyes. I feel like I can see the whole world. In Thailand I could only see a small amount, just the world I was living in and nothing outside of it.
Elissa: Are there parts of traditional Karen culture that you don’t identify with since living in the United States? How do you balance that traditionalism with mainstream American culture?
Kyeh: For me I try to not lose my culture, because it is important to me to keep that identity even while living in another mainstream culture or society. I try to still be in community with people who have similarities or are Karen so I can feel connected that way with my culture. For example, my parents, when I first came here growing up, I was told that girls aren't supposed to wear shorts or short skirts or anything above the knee. And living here, especially, when it gets hot I have to wear shorts. I think that if you still want to be in that culture and live within it you just have to be aware of spending time with others from your culture.
Elissa: So basically, you are saying that you are picking your battles in terms of what you are going to push back against?
Kyeh: Yeah, something like that.
Elissa: So, you are trying to be respectful, but you also know that your perspective might be different?
All: Yeah
The Karen People
We encourage our readers to visit the Karen Organization of Minnesota website in order to learn more about the history and culture of the Karen people.
Part 2: Immigration
Elissa: What is the best thing about living in the USA?
Re: Getting a good education, like even seeking to go forward for college or postsecondary there are people willing to help and help us to try to achieve our dreams. Back in Thailand, I felt like a lot of us or most of us didn't have a lot of dreams. So even after you have been graduating from a school, [for] everyone as long as they have a stable job, that is good enough for them. They don't really have a house or really professional job.
Kyeh: I feel like living in the USA the younger kids are being heard, because when we were [in Thailand] it was mostly focused on the elders and it didn't seem like our voices were heard. We were told in the refugee camp that kids aren't as important as the adults and older people. So I think that it is best [here] because our voice is heard.
Hsar: The food, the vegetables, and egg or meat, or anything that you might want to eat. There is so much food that I never tried before. Back then I was so skinny, and now I'm not. I really like to try the different types of things.
Htoo: The best thing is resting. Back in Thailand we were sometimes at school, but we were also out in the field.
Kyeh: It is better, because in Thailand some kids didn't have enough food and didn't always get to eat meals. So I think that this is better, and we can get an education here.
Re: I would also say the freedom. We have more freedom here, because when we lived in Thailand we had limited freedom because it was a refugee camp. We were not allowed to leave the camp. We were not allowed to do anything.
Elissa: How old were all of you when you came?
Re: I was 9.
Kyeh: I was 11.
Hsar: I was 10.
Htoo: I was 12.
Elissa: So, you guys can all clearly remember what life was like there and what it is like here?
Elissa: What is the worst thing about living in the USA?
Kyeh: Well, I have seen a lot of problems here, like different racial situations. In Thailand we are all the same, and we are together. We lived in small communities, like we shared the littlest thing that we had. Coming here, at times, we are so isolated, you know, and I don’t think that is a good thing. We’re all in different places; we’re not as close as like other.
Re: People say like in America you have a lot of freedom, but basically you have to pay for hospital bill, car bill, water bill, electricity bill, and if you are on medications you have to pay for that. You know, you just have to pay for a lot of stuff.
Kyeh: You know, we think of it as the best, but there are still other problems that we need to solve.
Htoo: I would say waking up early. Young kids, you know, they have to wake up early. I don’t know if I think that is healthy for them.
Elissa: You mean for school?
Htoo: Yeah. Nowadays they have technology, and kids stay up too late, and they don’t get enough sleep. They want things a lot, and they want it quickly. They also are disrespectful at times when they do things like talk back to their mom. They respond with that they have freedom and can do whatever they want. Back in Thailand it was different, you know. You got to listen to your parents, because if you don’t, you go and be a soldier and fight for your country.
Elissa: So, discipline is different now being here in the United States.
Kyeh: Kids are kind of using their freedom to do everything. They want to go against their parents and say things like, “It’s America, so there is freedom.” At times they use that as an excuse to get away with things.
Htoo: It’s hard, because in America you can’t really depend on someone else to take care of you. You have to have work and get a job you got to have those things in order to be able to afford rent. Back in Thailand if you have no one or no money you could just go live with someone, and they would do the things that needed to be done to support.
Elissa: Have you ever felt excluded because of your culture?
Re: When we first came I felt excluded, because I was Karen. At my school that I went to there wasn’t many Asian students. It was mostly white and black, and they didn’t know much about me. A few kids tried to come up and talk to me, but mostly they would just ask my name. We couldn't really communicate either, because I didn't really know how to speak English.
Htoo: You know, when I come to America there was not a lot of Karen kids, and the less you are home the less you would communicate. If you need to go somewhere, they will go with you. If you have to travel, you just ask them and they will help you out. It's like being one together. Like when the teacher would sit with you, you would feel kind of bad, but if there is another person who needs help you don’t feel so bad and you can do it together, you know. So, with a ton of Karen people helping each other, it is good.
Elissa: What was the hardest part about transitioning from living in Thailand to living in the US?
Re: Adapting to everything, like my surroundings, the people, and the food. Everything was new and had changed completely. I was really confused when I got here. I didn't understand what was happening around me. I had to make myself learn more about other stuff and challenge myself to be more adapted to it.
Kyeh: The hardest thing for me was socializing, because I didn't know how to speak English, but I learned to try to speak with others. I would want to ask questions, but it was hard to do, because I don't know English. I would wonder if I should ask it myself or just let it go. Kids talking to teachers were like so close to each other. They don't separate themselves from the teachers. When teachers say something that they don’t like, they would talk back. So, I didn't know what I was supposed to act like.
Htoo: I’m ok with everything as it is, because when I was a kid I was very curious. I would wonder why do you need friends to be happy or why do you need other people. I would just always be on my own, just finding my own way. I had just come to America, and it opened my eyes. I feel like I can see the whole world. In Thailand I could only see a small amount, just the world I was living in and nothing outside of it.
Elissa: Are there parts of traditional Karen culture that you don’t identify with since living in the United States? How do you balance that traditionalism with mainstream American culture?
Kyeh: For me I try to not lose my culture, because it is important to me to keep that identity even while living in another mainstream culture or society. I try to still be in community with people who have similarities or are Karen so I can feel connected that way with my culture. For example, my parents, when I first came here growing up, I was told that girls aren't supposed to wear shorts or short skirts or anything above the knee. And living here, especially, when it gets hot I have to wear shorts. I think that if you still want to be in that culture and live within it you just have to be aware of spending time with others from your culture.
Elissa: So basically, you are saying that you are picking your battles in terms of what you are going to push back against?
Kyeh: Yeah, something like that.
Elissa: So, you are trying to be respectful, but you also know that your perspective might be different?
All: Yeah
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